Spoke tension, according to Brandt

[Hipster]

I so had to chuckle at his response to my post. Talk about calling the kettle black!!!

Dr. Duk's post here from yesterday gave me the troll thought as I read his words last night.

In all fairness to poor unsuspecting (yuku.catrike) 'freddd' (he knew not what could happen with an innocent question), I'll try to remember to dig out my Parks TM-1 & get him some readings from decently tensioned hand built Cat wheels. 

[trikebldr]

Hippy, I already sent him a PM with some specs and an invitation to TD. My HS wheels read 23 on the meter, which is 209lbs of tension. Just what Sheldon advises.

[Hipster]

Thanks BB ... when did you send him the info?

[trikebldr]

About 15 minutes ago.

[Hipster]

That's grand sir! I'll take measurements from my sets for comparison purposes ... it will be interesting to see how much variation I come up with.

[devious56]

You guys make sure to make these numbers public.  Please................................ and thanks for the effort.

David

[trikebldr]

See reply number 16 above, David! It has my numbers!

[trikebldr]

Greg, and anybody else interested, keep in mind that my numbers are from Holey Spokes. Not sure if you guys will want them quite that tight. Sheldon recommends about 200lbs max, and mine works out to 209lbs from the conversion chart. I would recommend about 185lbs for most applications where ultimate handling isn't the focus. I'm willing to take a chance on rim failure later for better handling NOW! Running 140psi in my Stelvios adds to the failure possibility, too, but that's the chances we take!

[jimali]

Greg, and anybody else interested, keep in mind that my numbers are from Holey Spokes. Not sure if you guys will want them quite that tight. Sheldon recommends about 200lbs max, and mine works out to 209lbs from the conversion chart. I would recommend about 185lbs for most applications where ultimate handling isn't the focus. I'm willing to take a chance on rim failure later for better handling NOW! Running 140psi in my Stelvios adds to the failure possibility, too, but that's the chances we take!

OK, Devil's Advocate observation here:

you're addressing Elso's loose spokes as being improperly tensioned, on the low side,
and, 
at the same time, you confess to running your own spokes, improperly tensioned, on the high side.
 
You're both acknowledging the possibility of wheel failure with your chosen tension while describing the benefits of your chosen tension theory.

You're both saying "be careful" if you do what I do.

[John Rooker]

I just did a quick check on the two Trails.  I don't know if Gary worked on his spokes or not, but his trike measures right around 100 kgf.  My wife's Trail...76! 

[Wraith Rider]

To me, there's a big difference between an evenly over-tensioned wheel and a loose wheel with ticking spokes which was being purported by others on the Cat board as nothing to worry about.

A loose wheel that ticks is more an likely unevenly tensioned and a much more worrisome wheel.  That's just my opinion.  Still, why anyone would deliberately run a "soft" wheel is ludicrous.

[jimali]

DATA
I just measured a new set of factory wheels, just out of the box
20" fronts,  26" rear            ALL 2.0 mm spokes
starting with "key" spoke, running clockwise
          Right Front          Left Front              Rear
          outside   inside    outside   inside    right       left
1        235        187        187        187        266        150
2        235        187        167        150        301        123
3        266        187        187        136        266        150
4        266        235        167        136        266        150
5        235        187        187        167        266        136
6        209        187        150        167        266        150
7        266        209        167        123        235        150
8        209        167        150        106        343        136
9        266        235        187        209        266        167
10      235        209        187        123        266        112
11      266        235        187        136        266        209
12      235        235        150        136        301        106
13      266        187        187        136        235        167
14      235        187        187        167        301        150
15      266        187        123        150        235        167
16      235        187        187        123        301        136

Park Tools reading >>  KgF  x 2.2 =  lbf

[John Rooker]

Nice wheel to wheel consistency on the fronts!   

[jimali]

"consistency " , "consistency ",    we don' need no stinkin' consistency  !

[John Rooker]

Average:

228.69 Right outside
172.31 Left Outside

Difference of 56.38 on two wheels that should be nearly identical.